Today's tasks are also Next actions

PRO

Folke 09/09/2013 15:26

Platform:AllCompleted

In GTD, a Next action is an action that you have decided to do and which is perfectly possible to consider doing now. This means that even the tasks on the Today list are GTD Next actions until they have been completed, and should be included on the Next list. This would be GTD.

Currently the starred Next actions are hidden from the Next list, which makes the Next list incomplete. As a user you then have to alter between the two lists (and use your memory) to see (and remember) your Next actions, which makes it very troublesome to get an overview, and perhaps even more importantly it makes it troublesome to adjust the tentative selection of tasks you had aimed at some stage to perhaps be able to complete today.

It is also a "formal violation" of GTD's core principles, if that matters. GTD is based on situational decisions being made based on Context, Time, Energy and Priority - not an any fixed plan for what you are going to do on any particular day, not even today, as those decision factors can change rapidly, and new tasks and circumstances can enter the picture, and you may even want to remove the star when you realize you will not do this task today after all. (It would be more appropriate to think of the Today list as a view of "flagged" actions from other lists - a GTD "white index card" - than as a separate list of tasks.)

So please reconsider.

And, on a more humorous side note, I promise it would also look very nice and decorative to have a few of those nice yellow stars on the Next list :-)))

hntopper post on 09/09/2013 15:35#1

PRO

@folke +1 I concur.
NEODK post on 09/09/2013 15:57#2

PRO

+1 @Folke I totally agree
redtel post on 09/09/2013 17:07#3

+1
michelle1987 post on 09/10/2013 09:00#5

PRO

@redtel @NEODK @hntopper @Folke

Hello,

Today in Doit.im: If you set the Start time to today, the task will come to Today box directly. For the tasks whose Start time is set to be later than today, they'll come to Today box on the exact day of starting, and will stay in the box until you complete it.

Next in Doit,.im: Actions to be done as soon as possible but with no exact start time are put here.

Our suggestion for people who are using Doit.im: Complete tasks in Today first and when you complete them all and there are still some time left today, then go to Next box and select some tasks that you can do today.

And here, do you mean that all the tasks in Today should be shown in Next and the Today box should be removed? When all the tasks are shown in a list, it probably brings much more pressure. :(

In the future, we will introduce a “Daily Plan" feature. In the “Daily Plan", you will see all your tasks in Today and Next, which will be an easier way for you to manage today's tasks.

If you have further questions, please feel free to contact us.

Thanks for your support on Doit.im.
Folke post on 09/10/2013 10:00#6

PRO

Thanks for the answer, Michelle,

Doit is a very fine app, and there are ways to work around most things. I really like Doit for many reasons :-)

But I am afraid that in order to do GTD with Doit you have to use workarounds, which is is a pity, since it is meant to be a GTD app. I don't think you need to make it more complicated by introducing a Daily plan. And there is no such thing in GTD. From your description, it sounds as if the "Daily plan" is the GTD Next list. No need to have one more Next list - just fix the one you have :-)

You are asking "And here, do you mean that all the tasks in Today should be shown in Next and the Today box should be removed?"

My answer is
- Yes, I mean that all the tasks in Next should also be shown in Next, in whatever position they are standing, but with stars and lightnings visible.
- No, I would not want you to remove the Today list. This list is very useful both as a summary of all the items you have starred from all over your Next list, and also serves as an "inbox" for all the tasks that come in from Scheduled.

And this brings me to another GTD topic - Scheduled. All GTD apps have this simplified approach, which I like, but I notice it also gives rise to a lot of confusion, because Scheduled is really two entirely different things:

1) Scheduled for Action.
This is called Calendar action in GTD. It is something that you will do on a particular day (usually a particular time of day.) In GTD you only use this for tasks that are objectively fixed in time by agreement with others, or have been imposed on you by others. Apart from that, you simply do not "plan" tasks to a date or time in GTD. The whole point is to keep things as open as possible and determine what you will do based on the Context, Time, Energy, and Priority as of the moment you choose to do it.

2) Scheduled for Processing/Review/Consideration
This is what the GTD Tickler file is all about. Some things are impossible to decide, or irrelevant to even look at, before a certain date has arrived, so you keep these things "hibernating" in the GTD Tickler file for now. When the tickler date arrives you need to look at the task and decide what to do with it. Maybe you will do it today, maybe later, maybe trash it.

It is simply wrong to assume that all items that come into the Today list from Scheduled are meant to be actually done today. Many, or probably most of them, are in fact type 2, i.e. ticklers, i.e. tasks that have been "sleeping" and which you can now begin to consider.

Some examples of "Scheduled for Review" are:
- you have just had a haircut, and don't want to see an irrelevant task "Get a new haircut" on your Next list for the next four weeks. You put it in the GTD Tickler file ("Scheduled for Review"). When that day comes, maybe you get a haircut that day, but just as likely you will do it sometime later.
- you have borrowed something from your neighbor and have to give it back, the sooner the better, but no big hurry. You have to hand it to her in person to make sure she gets it. Unfortunately, the neighbor is away on vacation and will be home on October 1 and you do not want to see this impossible task on your Next list every day until then. You therefore put this in the GTD Tickler file (Scheduled for Review). On October 1 you will probably put this in Next (with or without a Today star).

I hope this helps. GTD is really the total opposite of regular time planning.

All GTD apps that I know of has taken the shortcut to treat Calendar actions and Tickler file items in the same way. Doit is not the only one. It would be nice and useful if apps made a clearer distinction. It would be good to see clearly if an action that sits in Scheduled or has been moved into Today or is displayed in a calendar is actually scheduled for action that day (e.g a project meeting) or is just scheduled for review.
delta6 post on 09/10/2013 15:55#7

PRO

I agree with @Folke

You guys should keep Doit.im simple and create a true GTD Next list. This would be a GREAT improvement and people familiar with GTD would immediately know what a Next list is, and how to use it.
michelle1987 post on 09/11/2013 10:08#8

PRO

@Folke @delta6

Q1: And this brings me to another GTD topic - Scheduled. All GTD apps have this simplified approach, which I like, but I notice it also gives rise to a lot of confusion, because Scheduled is really two entirely different things:

1) Scheduled for Action.
This is called Calendar action in GTD. It is something that you will do on a particular day (usually a particular time of day.) In GTD you only use this for tasks that are objectively fixed in time by agreement with others, or have been imposed on you by others. Apart from that, you simply do not "plan" tasks to a date or time in GTD. The whole point is to keep things as open as possible and determine what you will do based on the Context, Time, Energy, and Priority as of the moment you choose to do it.

2) Scheduled for Processing/Review/Consideration
This is what the GTD Tickler file is all about. Some things are impossible to decide, or irrelevant to even look at, before a certain date has arrived, so you keep these things "hibernating" in the GTD Tickler file for now. When the tickler date arrives you need to look at the task and decide what to do with it. Maybe you will do it today, maybe later, maybe trash it.

A: Do you mean that there should be two schedules? One is grouped by Start time, and the other one is by Deadline?
Now, we are support grouping tasks by Start time.

Q2: It is simply wrong to assume that all items that come into the Today list from Scheduled are meant to be actually done today. Many, or probably most of them, are in fact type 2, i.e. ticklers, i.e. tasks that have been "sleeping" and which you can now begin to consider.

A: Now, you can add a deadline to the task and as for its start time, it can be not today. Thus, the task will go to Today automatically on its due day.

Q3: you have just had a haircut, and don't want to see an irrelevant task "Get a new haircut" on your Next list for the next four weeks. You put it in the GTD Tickler file ("Scheduled for Review"). When that day comes, maybe you get a haircut that day, but just as likely you will do it sometime later.

- you have borrowed something from your neighbor and have to give it back, the sooner the better, but no big hurry. You have to hand it to her in person to make sure she gets it. Unfortunately, the neighbor is away on vacation and will be home on October 1 and you do not want to see this impossible task on your Next list every day until then. You therefore put this in the GTD Tickler file (Scheduled for Review). On October 1 you will probably put this in Next (with or without a Today star).

A: You can put the task in Waiting box and add a deadline to it. Thus, it will go to Today automatically on its due day. By then, whether it could be done today or not is up to you. If you don't want to do it today, you can rearrange it.

Thanks for your feedback and support.
Folke post on 09/11/2013 10:58#9

PRO

Thanks, Michelle, for taking the trouble to read and answer my long post

I'll summarize it:

- If you want Doit to really be a correct GTD app, then the Next list should contain all those tasks that are now on the Next list and Today list. They are all GTD Next actions.

- The today list is till "needed" (useful) as a short summary of all your starred items

- I wrote a separate post on the distinction between calendar actions and other actions with dates: http://help.doit.im/topics/1529
An overall observation, though, is that if Doit aspires to be a GTD solution, then you simply have to take into account the fact that in GTD you simply do not schedule your own time. But you still need to deal with dates that have been imposed on you by others or which you have explicitly agreed to ("objective" calendar actions and deadlines). And you use Tickler dates to hide things that are yet "objectively" impossible to consider doing. But beyond that you simply do not plan your own time. You make no decisions at all in advance that you will do this and this on Tuesday, then this and this on Wednesday etc. That's totally taboo in GTD, and for very good reasons. This is the big difference between GTD and all the far more popular task management methodologies. (The majority of people probably hate GTD - they cannot accept this. But for some people, also quite a few, GTD is the only way.)

- GTD Waiting is intended for tasks that other people will complete and which you could expect at anytime from now on. If you cannot expect it until after a certain earliest possible date you would put it in the GTD Tickler file (i.e. Scheduled), which is the GTD "hibernation" container for all "dates" that you are waiting for, so that you do not have these tasks clutter your view in Next or Waiting. Ideally, to make Doit really elegant and powerful and super-GTD, you could make it possible to schedule tasks to land in Waiting (not necessarily in Next). Example: You will expect somebody to send you a monthly report in the first week of the following month. Then this could be Scheduled as task to be shown in Waiting on the 1st (and also preferably starred, so you can see it in Today when it arrives, or have some other notification mechanism) and have a deadline for it on the 7th (notification/starred again).
michelle1987 post on 09/12/2013 09:48#10

PRO

@Folke

Q: If you want Doit to really be a correct GTD app, then the Next list should contain all those tasks that are now on the Next list and Today list. They are all GTD Next actions.

A: We will seriously consider it.

Q: the distinction between calendar actions and other actions with dates: http://help.doit.im/topics/1529

A: We will discuss with you in the ticket #1529, http://help.doit.im/topics/1529

We are striving for a better product. Thanks for sharing your thoughts with us. :)